hasselblad Thu, 17 May 2001 Volume 1 : Number 1229 In this issue: RE: Got the Softar - next question Re: Got the Softar - next question Re: Softars Re: Got the Softar - next question RE: Softars RE: Softars Re: RE: Softars RE: Softars Got the Softar - next question Re: 2X Converters Re: 2X Converters a laptop question --am seeking one to download photos in the field? 300/4 at 1/15? Re: a laptop question --am seeking one to download photos in the field? Re: 300/4 at 1/15? Re: Zoomars RE: 350/4 at 1/15? Re: a laptop question --am seeking one to download photos in the field? Re: a laptop question --am seeking one to download photos in the field? Re: [Rollei] Zoomar Re: [Rollei] Zoomar Re: Softars ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 10:23:33 +0200 From: "Eduard Crombie" To: "Simon Lamb" , Subject: RE: Got the Softar - next question Message-ID: > I will be using the Softars for some studio flash > shots but, having never used one and not having > any documentation with them, can anyone tell me > if I need any exposure compensation when using them? If so, how much? > > Simon Hello Simon, Small contribution on this. I have a Softar II from 1977. Softar lenses are made up of small lens elements distributed evenly on the filter. These things even have a name, "Gloriole"(D). Their specific pattern of light shattering characteristic causes a clear zone surrounded by an unsharp type of 'flare'. The denser the distribution of these little lenses, the higher the effect, which is not entirely the same as a 'softening filter' (like a partly matted glass filter or a nylon stocking over the lens with a hole burnt in the middle). (gr) The effect is maximal using backlighting and keeping the contrast within certain proportions. There is no exposure compensation and a very slight underexposure is preferred to prevent excessive flare and a 'general' unpleasant unsharpness. Only in two cases I remember using this Softar: portraits of ladies, of an age where certain natural defects of the skin start being noticeable. And teenagers with excessive skin ailments or the resulting scars. Never use it on men, or older ladies who have come to terms with what they see in their mirror. They will feel insulted, believe me ("What have you done to my wrinkles ?", "That does not look like me !"). Even after many years I still don't have a complete understanding of the psychology about people being confronted with their own image. Kind regards, Eduard Crombie Dendermonde, Belgium. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 09:36:00 -0400 From: "Peter Klosky" To: Subject: Re: Got the Softar - next question Message-ID: <000801c0de0d$25f70260$230a210a@dulles> > Even after many years I still don't have a complete understanding of the > psychology about people being confronted with their own image. > Eduard Crombie Eduard, I, too, have had some interesting experiences regarding people's reactions to their own image. For example, I had one client several years ago who was a stunning beauty, whose wedding photos were excellent, but she none the less was unsatisfied, or at least thought she could gain an upper hand in negotiations by being hypercritical of the work. She was at the prime of her beauty, and the photos captured it well. I think I did her portrait in five distinct settings around the small urban hotel where she was married. On the other hand, I've had clients who were less attractive want "sharp as a tack" portraits, and be quite happy with them. Just yesterday evening I delivered the third large order from a woman who is perhaps 150 or 200 lbs. overweight. Her interest in photos is quite well established within her personality, as she is the type who always organizes group photos at family events and has an extensive collection of family photos. This is an extension of her role as a parent and elder within her social circle. This is sometimes described as "being into familial love." This personality type can make the best client, as demonstrated by her buying. In addition, it became clear at yesterday's presentation that she has three other children getting married, and I am a candidate for even more work. Regarding softening, I try to make my capabilities clear during my initial presentation. If the client has a youthful look, I tell them up front that they require no softening. This is an extension of the general idea that making a portrait requires some analysis of their facial type. For each client, I explain to them what I would do in their case, adjusting it for their interests and needs. I show a portrait done with umbrellas/softening filter and suggest the same technique could be used in their case, then allow them to provide some direction. Peter ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 11:23:51 -0400 From: Henry Posner/B&H Photo-Video To: Subject: Re: Softars Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20010516111643.00cd7c50@bnhpop1.bhphotovideo.com> At 03:40 AM 05/16/2001, you wrote: >Actually Henry I've shot over a hundred weddings, from '75 to '95. And >I've not >ever had ANY body ask me for a tight head shot! As a matter of fact from the >waist up is tight because full length is the norm for some reason! Generally, I don't ask. I shoot full length, 3/4, h&s and tight heads. More good images = more sales. ROFL. In my experience people are quite accepting of what I often consider quite mediocre, but I still prefer to produce stuff I'm proud of. Sorry, but you are wrong there. Many commercial people I know recognize the value and benefit of diffusion when judiciously applied. Take a closer look at the next up-scale magazine you get -- ads and articles. You won't see as many as you will from a typical wedding, but they're there. Often, they're subtle enough you're not looking AT the soft effect, but at an image rendered more to the art director's liking by diffusion. >Do the Softars not come in large sizes? Up to 86mm round plus Lindahl size. >Those movie guys can afford to special order anything! >"What? only 2 grand to have me special order the 72 mm Softar?! I'll take >three of them!" Actually a B+W Zeiss Softar in 72mm is <$200.00. -- regards, Henry Posner Director of Sales and Training B&H Photo-Video, and Pro-Audio Inc. http://www.bhphotovideo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 11:24:19 -0400 From: Henry Posner/B&H Photo-Video To: Subject: Re: Got the Softar - next question Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20010516112407.00cd89a0@bnhpop1.bhphotovideo.com> At 03:40 AM 05/16/2001, you wrote: >I will be using the Softars for some studio flash shots but, having >never used one and not having any documentation with them, can anyone >tell me if I need any exposure compensation when using them? If so, how much? None. -- regards, Henry Posner Director of Sales and Training B&H Photo-Video, and Pro-Audio Inc. http://www.bhphotovideo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 12:28:02 -0400 From: "Austin Franklin" To: Subject: RE: Softars Message-ID: > Sorry, but you are wrong there. Many commercial people I know > recognize the > value and benefit of diffusion when judiciously applied. Take a > closer look > at the next up-scale magazine you get -- ads and articles. You > won't see as > many as you will from a typical wedding, but they're there. > Often, they're > subtle enough you're not looking AT the soft effect, but at an image > rendered more to the art director's liking by diffusion. How do you know it isn't done after the fact? We NEVER used any softars, and any softening was done in the darkroom/digitally. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 09:55:56 -0700 From: Jim Brick To: hasselblad@kelvin.net, Subject: RE: Softars Message-ID: <4.1.20010516095024.0419ce20@xsj02.sjs.agilent.com> At 12:28 PM 5/16/01 -0400, Austin Franklin wrote: > >How do you know it isn't done after the fact? We NEVER used any softars, >and any softening was done in the darkroom/digitally. You cannot soften in the darkroom if you are printing from a negative. You will soften the black (clear areas of the negative) rather than the white highlights. And from a positive in the darkroom, it is not the same as creating highlight microflare when taking the photograph, although better than attempting to soften a negative after the fact. Photoshop, however, is a different story. You can get any look you want. Jim ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 12:50:00 EDT From: DKFletcher@aol.com To: hasselblad@kelvin.net Subject: Re: RE: Softars Message-ID: <40.b9e0c0b.283409b8@aol.com> In a message dated 5/16/1 10:28:35 AM, you wrote: >How do you know it isn't done after the fact? We NEVER used any softars, >and any softening was done in the darkroom/digitally. If it was done in the darkroom the shadows would bleed into the highlights instead of the other way around as it would be with a Softar or net on the lens. Dirk ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 13:15:18 -0400 From: "Austin Franklin" To: Subject: RE: Softars Message-ID: > At 12:28 PM 5/16/01 -0400, Austin Franklin wrote: > > > >How do you know it isn't done after the fact? We NEVER used any softars, > >and any softening was done in the darkroom/digitally. > > You cannot soften in the darkroom if you are printing from a negative. You > will soften the black (clear areas of the negative) rather than the white > highlights. And from a positive in the darkroom, it is not the same as > creating highlight microflare when taking the photograph, although better > than attempting to soften a negative after the fact. Most (if not all, at least for color) commercial work we did was shot with chrome, and I believe that is true for the commercial photography industry in general. I believe the statement was magazine work, not wedding/portrait work...which I would agree is probably 'softened' on the camera, as opposed to post processed. > Photoshop, however, is a different story. You can get any look you want. I believe most mainstream magazine advertisement photos, for say the past 10 years, have been digitally processed. And digital certainly is gaining in use, since the cost has come down so substantially in the past few years. I still have my original copy of "Digital Darkroom" for the Mac from 1988! Perhaps I ought to put it on eBay ;-) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 13:10:19 -0500 From: Don Nelson To: HassyArtists Subject: Got the Softar - next question Message-ID: <3B02C28A.66E93ECB@mr.net> I usually lurk, but your question brings me out - thanks. > Only in two cases I remember using this Softar: portraits of ladies, of > an age where certain natural defects of the skin start being noticeable. > And teenagers with excessive skin ailments or the resulting scars. > Never use it on men, or older ladies who have come to terms with what > they see in their mirror. They will feel insulted, believe me ("What > have you done to my wrinkles ?", "That does not look like me !"). > Even after many years I still don't have a complete understanding of the > psychology about people being confronted with their own image. > Eduard Crombie I certainly do not either, but now I am only interested in what I think I need do to 'capture the Sitter's Spirit'. I did my grandmother 2 or 3 decades ago with my C330 w/180mm just before I got my new 500C. When I delivered her (tack sharp in available light) 8x10 she said "You even got my hair net" and put the picture face down on a shelf and asked if I were hungry..... Several months later she called me and said "I've been looking at your picture. I really like it now, thanks"...... I had been scared to show it to her and she did not want to see it at first because I saw a gentle, wise, OLD woman. That was her. If I had been making my living selling as many pics as possible I would have shot both with a 150 and a softar so they would have had the ability to chose sharp or dull to purchase. Today I own all the B/W filters I need, but have never considered using a softar because of that lesson. I do not need to sell because I am an artist.?.? I am also having a very hard time getting back into this craft, much less the Art. Tonight I start a darkroom class. I am taking negatives from a project done in 1977 on old people in homes. This whole process scares me. Thanks for your questions and your time. taking myself much too serious, Don Nelson ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 20:53:20 +0200 From: "Q.G. de Bakker" To: Subject: Re: 2X Converters Message-ID: <006701c0de39$7bc0a9e0$17f6f1c3@qnu350> Evan J Dong wrote: > Q.G. de Bakker, any information on your front regarding a return to Zeiss > for the next generation Mutar or can we just forget about it? I have no info, but i wouldn't hold my breath waiting. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 22:39:35 +0100 From: "Simon Lamb" To: "Q.G. de Bakker" , Subject: Re: 2X Converters Message-ID: <000901c0de50$b3e5b6a0$a3737bd5@btopenworld.com> I spoke to Hasselblad in the UK and they are enquiring in Sweden about the Zeiss Mutar. It seems there may still be some around within Hasselblad. I will let you know if I turn anything up. Simon Q.G. de Bakker wrote > > I have no info, but i wouldn't hold my breath waiting. > > Evan J Dong wrote: > > > Q.G. de Bakker, any information on your front regarding a return to Zeiss > > for the next generation Mutar or can we just forget about it? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 21:31:50 EDT From: Msfoto@aol.com To: hasselblad@kelvin.net Subject: a laptop question --am seeking one to download photos in the field? Message-ID: does anyone have a laptop with a built in CD-RW that they use in the field with a card reader ( from digital camera) that is reliable and has NO conflicts!!!???! am searching for one! thanks R ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 22:00:40 -0400 From: "Austin Franklin" To: Subject: 300/4 at 1/15? Message-ID: From an add I saw: "Hasselblad FE 350mm4.0 Tele-Tessar, Like New! ... With 400 ASA film, you can usually shoot wide open at 1/15th second, and get perfect available light exposures." I guess he only claim you'll get perfect exposures, not perfectly sharp images ;-) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 19:04:03 -0700 From: David Gerhardt To: hasselblad@kelvin.net Subject: Re: a laptop question --am seeking one to download photos in the field? Message-ID: <200105170203.WAA16396@hall.mail.mindspring.net> --Apple-Mail-99574845-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii I've been using Macs to do this for about a year (desktop). Am about to buy one of the new iBooks (~$1400, w/CD-RW), to do just what you're asking. As long as you set the machine up properly (ie, without a thousand extra inits or extensions), you should have no problem. I find the easiest way for my Nikon 880 is to just "plug it in" to the USB port, rather than use a card reader (although I've done both). -David Gerhardt On Wednesday, May 16, 2001, at 06:31 PM, Msfoto@aol.com wrote: > does anyone have a laptop with a built in CD-RW that they use in the > field > with a card reader ( from digital camera) that is reliable and has NO > conflicts!!!???! > am searching for one! thanks R > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > The Hasselblad Users Group Listserv is a public service of Absolute > Internet, Inc., which is not responsible for its content. This mailing > list is in no way affiliated with Victor Hasselblad AB, it's > subsidiaries, or affiliates. > > Please turn off HTML mail features prior to posting to this list. Use > text mode only. > > To change your subscription status, go to: > http://mail.kelvin.net/guest/RemoteListSummary/Hasselblad > Digest archives are stored at http://www.kelvin.net/hasselblad/hassy.htm > Searchable archives can be found at > http://www.listquest.com/arts/index.html > -David Gerhardt (davidgerhardt@mindspring.com) --Apple-Mail-99574845-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/enriched; charset=us-ascii I've been using Macs to do this for about a year (desktop). Am about to buy one of the new iBooks (~$1400, w/CD-RW), to do just what you're asking. As long as you set the machine up properly (ie, without a thousand extra inits or extensions), you should have no problem. I find the easiest way for my Nikon 880 is to just "plug it in" to the USB port, rather than use a card reader (although I've done both). -David Gerhardt On Wednesday, May 16, 2001, at 06:31 PM, Msfoto@aol.com wrote: does anyone have a laptop with a built in CD-RW that they use in the field=20 with a card reader ( from digital camera) that is reliable and has NO=20 conflicts!!!???! am searching for one! thanks R ---------------------------------------------------------------------- The Hasselblad Users Group Listserv is a public service of Absolute Internet, Inc., which is not responsible for its content. This mailing list is in no way affiliated with Victor Hasselblad AB, it's subsidiaries, or affiliates. Please turn off HTML mail features prior to posting to this list. =20 Use text mode only. To change your subscription status, go to: http://mail.kelvin.net/guest/RemoteListSummary/Hasselblad Digest archives are stored at http://www.kelvin.net/hasselblad/hassy.htm Searchable archives can be found at http://www.listquest.com/arts/index.html Gill = Sans3535,4747,8787-David Gerhardt American = Typewriter(davidgerhardt@mindspring.com)= --Apple-Mail-99574845-1-- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 22:16:39 EDT From: QWhoZeiss@aol.com To: hasselblad@kelvin.net Subject: Re: 300/4 at 1/15? Message-ID: Just because you or someone else has a problem handholding, do you think everyone has? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 22:17:59 EDT From: QWhoZeiss@aol.com To: hasselblad@kelvin.net Subject: Re: Zoomars Message-ID: Anyone have an intrested in putting Zoomars on Hasselblads? Lets talk. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 22:21:23 -0400 From: "Austin Franklin" To: Subject: RE: 350/4 at 1/15? Message-ID: > Just because you or someone else has a problem handholding, do you think > everyone has? I have no problem handholding, my wife and I do it all the time ;-) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 22:35:34 EDT From: Msfoto@aol.com To: hasselblad@kelvin.net Subject: Re: a laptop question --am seeking one to download photos in the field? Message-ID: <89.6b791be.283492f6@aol.com> which Ibook? do you know how long it takes to get one if you order it? thanks for the help ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 23:04:20 -0400 From: "Eugene A. Pallat" To: hasselblad@kelvin.net Subject: Re: a laptop question --am seeking one to download photos in the field? Message-ID: <3B033FB4.328B46B@apk.net> Msfoto@aol.com wrote: > does anyone have a laptop with a built in CD-RW that they use in the field > with a card reader ( from digital camera) that is reliable and has NO > conflicts!!!???! > am searching for one! thanks R You might look into the possibility of using a PCMCIA card and an external CD-RW drive. I use the Adaptec PCMCIA adapter for external devices. Gene Pallat Orion Data Systems Orion Forensics ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 23:31:52 -0400 From: Marc James Small To: hasselblad@kelvin.net Subject: Re: [Rollei] Zoomar Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20010516233152.00b2cda0@pop.infi-net.mindspring.com> At 05:44 PM 5/16/2001 EDT, QWhoZeiss@aol.com wrote: >Does anyone have intrested in putting Zoomar's on Hasselbads? This depends what you mean by "Zoomar". If you mean that original multi-focal-length lens, well, I don't believe it covers MF. If you mean the other "Zoomar" (ex-Kilfitt) lenses, a number of these DO cover MF, but what's the excitement? Find either the WEHA or WEHE adapter, and you're off to the races. But, shucks, Mike, YOU knew this! You taught me a lot of it. Marc msmall@roanoke.infi.net FAX: +540/343-7315 Cha robh bas fir gun ghras fir! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 23:52:43 -0400 From: "LEO WOLK" To: Subject: Re: [Rollei] Zoomar Message-ID: <01c0de84$d3b0c2c0$1e65570c@fofyplfq> Yeah, Right, Marc...ALL you have to do is find these! If you know where to locate clean "original" examples of either, please let me know, I've been looking for about 10 years to no avail! I managed to locate an original set ONCE in Texas, but the owner turned down my offer of $500 for the pair! I don't think more than a "handful" of either was made. And PULEESE DON'T tell me to call Ketzner! Leo. -----Original Message----- From: Marc James Small To: hasselblad@kelvin.net Date: Wednesday, May 16, 2001 11:31 PM Subject: Re: [Rollei] Zoomar >At 05:44 PM 5/16/2001 EDT, QWhoZeiss@aol.com wrote: >>Does anyone have intrested in putting Zoomar's on Hasselbads? > >...Find either the WEHA or WEHE adapter, and you're >off to the races... > > >Marc > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 21:00:13 -0700 From: Mark Rabiner To: hasselblad@kelvin.net Subject: Re: Softars Message-ID: <3B034CCE.BAA411FD@rabiner.cncoffice.com> DKFletcher@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 5/16/1 10:28:35 AM, you wrote: > > >How do you know it isn't done after the fact? We NEVER used any softars, > >and any softening was done in the darkroom/digitally. > > If it was done in the darkroom the shadows would bleed into the highlights > instead of the other way around as it would be with a Softar or net on the > lens. > > Dirk That's the DEVIL!! You don't want shadows bleeding into the highlights! 666! Extremely bad vibes dude!!! Upside down pentium! :) Mark Rabiner Portland, Oregon USA http://www.rabiner.cncoffice.com/ ------------------------------ End of hasselblad V1 #1229 ************************** ---------------------------------------------------------------------- The Hasselblad Users Group Listserv is a public service of Absolute Internet, Inc., which is not responsible for its content. This mailing list is in no way affiliated with Victor Hasselblad AB, it's subsidiaries, or affiliates. Please turn off HTML mail features prior to posting to this list. Use text mode only. To change your subscription status, go to: http://mail.kelvin.net/guest/RemoteListSummary/Hasselblad Digest archives are stored at http://www.kelvin.net/hasselblad/hassy.htm Searchable archives can be found at http://www.listquest.com/arts/index.html