hasselblad Wed, 6 Sep 2000 Volume 1 : Number 980 In this issue: RE: photographers Re: photographers RE: photographers Re: photographers RE: photographers Re: photographers http://fly.to/partenon ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 5 Sep 2000 06:37:05 -0400 From: "Paolo Pignatelli" To: Subject: RE: photographers Message-ID: <000001c01725$3cff7fa0$0100a8c0@paolopent> Ah, so right, English is not my mother tongue, but that last pun by Leo takes the crown. Paolo Paolo Pignatelli -----Original Message----- From: BobR38@aol.com [mailto:BobR38@aol.com] Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2000 12:45 AM To: hasselblad@kelvin.net Subject: Re: photographers In a message dated 9/4/00 8:10:40 PM Central Daylight Time, bigleo@worldnet.att.net writes: << You keep drilling us with these puns, Paolo... Getting a good one out of you is like pulling teeth! >> Leo, you are right....extracting a good pun out of Paolo is quite a challenge. Possibly the language could be at the root of the problem? Bob R. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- The Hasselblad Users Group Listserv is a public service of Absolute Internet, Inc., which is not responsible for its content. This mailing list is in no way affiliated with Victor Hasselblad AB, it's subsidiaries, or affiliates. To change your subscription status, go to: http://mail.kelvin.net/guest/RemoteListSummary/Hasselblad Digest archives are stored at http://www.kelvin.net/hasselblad/hassy.htm Searchable archives can be found at http://www.listquest.com/arts/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 3 Sep 2000 09:27:50 -0400 From: "stuart phillips" To: , Subject: Re: photographers Message-ID: <003301c015aa$c3782b30$3674799e@umb.edu> Where are you from? Your name seems obviously Italian, but are you perhaps Argentinian? What about cameras used by famous people? Here're two: Rollei 35 (miniature) - Queen of England Leica M3 - Yul Brynner (sp) stuart ----- Original Message ----- From: Paolo Pignatelli To: Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2000 6:37 AM Subject: RE: photographers > Ah, so right, English is not my mother tongue, but that last pun by Leo > takes the crown. > > Paolo > > Paolo Pignatelli > > > -----Original Message----- > From: BobR38@aol.com [mailto:BobR38@aol.com] > Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2000 12:45 AM > To: hasselblad@kelvin.net > Subject: Re: photographers > > > In a message dated 9/4/00 8:10:40 PM Central Daylight Time, > bigleo@worldnet.att.net writes: > > << You keep drilling us with these puns, Paolo... > Getting a good one out of you is like pulling teeth! > >> > Leo, you are right....extracting a good pun out of Paolo is quite a > challenge. > Possibly the language could be at the root of the problem? > > Bob R. > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > The Hasselblad Users Group Listserv is a public service of Absolute > Internet, Inc., which is not responsible for its content. This mailing list > is in no way affiliated with Victor Hasselblad AB, it's subsidiaries, or > affiliates. > > To change your subscription status, go to: > http://mail.kelvin.net/guest/RemoteListSummary/Hasselblad > Digest archives are stored at http://www.kelvin.net/hasselblad/hassy.htm > Searchable archives can be found at http://www.listquest.com/arts/index.html > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > The Hasselblad Users Group Listserv is a public service of Absolute Internet, Inc., which is not responsible for its content. This mailing list is in no way affiliated with Victor Hasselblad AB, it's subsidiaries, or affiliates. > > To change your subscription status, go to: http://mail.kelvin.net/guest/RemoteListSummary/Hasselblad > Digest archives are stored at http://www.kelvin.net/hasselblad/hassy.htm > Searchable archives can be found at http://www.listquest.com/arts/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Sep 2000 09:52:21 -0400 From: "Paolo Pignatelli" To: , Subject: RE: photographers Message-ID: <000901c01740$83ec9680$0100a8c0@paolopent> Hello Stuart, I was born here in the USA, my father was a diplomat (from the Order of Malta), but I grew up in many place, Panama, Ecuador, Italy, Switzerland, Ireland, France, ... . I always like math and science, but needed to learn languages to go to (the local) school. My side delectation, besides photography, is computational linguistics, and specifically, computer "understanding" of natural languages using semantic nets. I have an informal relationship with a few AI research sites in the US, mainly with Marvin Minsky at the Media labs. There is an application to photography to linguistics that interests me, specifically, measuring the amount of information in a picture, but not in the Shannon way. However, I never think about that when I take a picture. I see that you are at a university, what is your specialty? Paolo Paolo Pignatelli -----Original Message----- From: stuart phillips [mailto:stuart.phillips@umb.edu] Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2000 9:28 AM To: paolop@snet.net; hasselblad@kelvin.net Subject: Re: photographers Where are you from? Your name seems obviously Italian, but are you perhaps Argentinian? What about cameras used by famous people? Here're two: Rollei 35 (miniature) - Queen of England Leica M3 - Yul Brynner (sp) stuart ----- Original Message ----- From: Paolo Pignatelli To: Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2000 6:37 AM Subject: RE: photographers > Ah, so right, English is not my mother tongue, but that last pun by Leo > takes the crown. > > Paolo > > Paolo Pignatelli > > > -----Original Message----- > From: BobR38@aol.com [mailto:BobR38@aol.com] > Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2000 12:45 AM > To: hasselblad@kelvin.net > Subject: Re: photographers > > > In a message dated 9/4/00 8:10:40 PM Central Daylight Time, > bigleo@worldnet.att.net writes: > > << You keep drilling us with these puns, Paolo... > Getting a good one out of you is like pulling teeth! > >> > Leo, you are right....extracting a good pun out of Paolo is quite a > challenge. > Possibly the language could be at the root of the problem? > > Bob R. > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > The Hasselblad Users Group Listserv is a public service of Absolute > Internet, Inc., which is not responsible for its content. This mailing list > is in no way affiliated with Victor Hasselblad AB, it's subsidiaries, or > affiliates. > > To change your subscription status, go to: > http://mail.kelvin.net/guest/RemoteListSummary/Hasselblad > Digest archives are stored at http://www.kelvin.net/hasselblad/hassy.htm > Searchable archives can be found at http://www.listquest.com/arts/index.html > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > The Hasselblad Users Group Listserv is a public service of Absolute Internet, Inc., which is not responsible for its content. This mailing list is in no way affiliated with Victor Hasselblad AB, it's subsidiaries, or affiliates. > > To change your subscription status, go to: http://mail.kelvin.net/guest/RemoteListSummary/Hasselblad > Digest archives are stored at http://www.kelvin.net/hasselblad/hassy.htm > Searchable archives can be found at http://www.listquest.com/arts/index.html ---------------------------------------------------------------------- The Hasselblad Users Group Listserv is a public service of Absolute Internet, Inc., which is not responsible for its content. This mailing list is in no way affiliated with Victor Hasselblad AB, it's subsidiaries, or affiliates. To change your subscription status, go to: http://mail.kelvin.net/guest/RemoteListSummary/Hasselblad Digest archives are stored at http://www.kelvin.net/hasselblad/hassy.htm Searchable archives can be found at http://www.listquest.com/arts/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Sep 2000 21:07:16 +0200 From: "Q.G. de Bakker" To: , Subject: Re: photographers Message-ID: <003401c0176c$aae64b60$2bc8f1c3@qnu99> Paolo Pignatelli wrote: > [...] My side delectation, besides > photography, is computational linguistics, and specifically, computer > "understanding" of natural languages using semantic nets. Prolog or LISP? I had to do some of this too once. But since i was not particularly fond of linguistics (sorry!), instead, i used semantic nets, frames and all, to build a rudimentary skeleton system to automagically classify given information (pretending to transform information into knowledge ;-) ), rearranging itself to accomodate newly gained 'insights'. Sadly, to make it work for real, it had to have a natural language parsing front end... But i got away with it. Using Prolog, of course... > I have an > informal relationship with a few AI research sites in the US, mainly with > Marvin Minsky at the Media labs. So LISP it is? > There is an application to photography to linguistics that interests me, > specifically, measuring the amount of information in a picture, but not in > the Shannon way. Wouldn't that require real-world (as opposed to closed-world) image recognition? Can this ever be done? It's hard enough to automate language processing, and language is a rather structured affair. But our visual world... phew! > However, I never think about that when I take a picture. That is, i think, a good thing! ;-) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Sep 2000 17:07:43 -0400 From: "Paolo Pignatelli" To: "'Q.G. de Bakker'" , Cc: Subject: RE: photographers Message-ID: <001801c0177d$559801b0$0100a8c0@paolopent> Actually, at this point, I am still developing the structure. I am considering modeling it in Wolfram's Mathematica, since there are a few programs already done on semantic nets there. With Marvin, the emphasis was on the nature of language, and to the question of "common sense", whether machines can ever achieve it (we believe so, but it is So hard to define, let alone to implement). My emphasis too is knowledge extraction, but it is based on my experience as a simultaneous interpreter. I (want to) associate objects with their placement in a very rich semantic map. The "word in context" causes perturbations in the map, some of these perturbations being rules that associate it with other objects (a stochastic method), other perturbations associating it with grammatical rules, other rules acting as feedback mechanisms, etc... . The whole may be seen as a complexity problem with the parameters of the attractors being the rules of the semantic net. As to the information content of an image, I start out with image recognition programs (the field I worked on at Bell labs about 25 years ago...), and associate these objects with the semantic network mentioned earlier. I see (pardon the pun) a grammar for visual space as similar to one in the natural languages space. The main difference, and it is a huge one, is that visual spaces do not necessarily resolve as basins of attraction, or there are infinite (or non-denumerable) solutions. I see that I am straying quite a bit form the NG topic, but there are potential applications to photography, both in auto focus (Yikes!) areas, as well as in storage (quite cool, in a digital kind of way). Keep well, Paolo Paolo Pignatelli -----Original Message----- From: Q.G. de Bakker [mailto:qnu@worldonline.nl] Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2000 3:07 PM To: paolop@snet.net; hasselblad@kelvin.net Subject: Re: photographers Paolo Pignatelli wrote: > [...] My side delectation, besides > photography, is computational linguistics, and specifically, computer > "understanding" of natural languages using semantic nets. Prolog or LISP? I had to do some of this too once. But since i was not particularly fond of linguistics (sorry!), instead, i used semantic nets, frames and all, to build a rudimentary skeleton system to automagically classify given information (pretending to transform information into knowledge ;-) ), rearranging itself to accomodate newly gained 'insights'. Sadly, to make it work for real, it had to have a natural language parsing front end... But i got away with it. Using Prolog, of course... > I have an > informal relationship with a few AI research sites in the US, mainly with > Marvin Minsky at the Media labs. So LISP it is? > There is an application to photography to linguistics that interests me, > specifically, measuring the amount of information in a picture, but not in > the Shannon way. Wouldn't that require real-world (as opposed to closed-world) image recognition? Can this ever be done? It's hard enough to automate language processing, and language is a rather structured affair. But our visual world... phew! > However, I never think about that when I take a picture. That is, i think, a good thing! ;-) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- The Hasselblad Users Group Listserv is a public service of Absolute Internet, Inc., which is not responsible for its content. This mailing list is in no way affiliated with Victor Hasselblad AB, it's subsidiaries, or affiliates. To change your subscription status, go to: http://mail.kelvin.net/guest/RemoteListSummary/Hasselblad Digest archives are stored at http://www.kelvin.net/hasselblad/hassy.htm Searchable archives can be found at http://www.listquest.com/arts/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Sep 2000 18:27:51 -0400 From: "Mr. E Crumpler, Jr" To: , Subject: Re: photographers Message-ID: <002401c0178b$2d3c6680$80a36520@computer> Yul Brenner used a variety of cameras, nikon, pentax, leica, etc. I looked at a book by his daughter and in many of the photographs he has a number of cameras- the worst was a shot of him on a set with 6-7 cameras of all types arround his neck. Gene Crumpler ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paolo Pignatelli" To: ; Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2000 9:52 AM Subject: RE: photographers > Hello Stuart, > > I was born here in the USA, my father was a diplomat (from the Order of > Malta), but I grew up in many place, Panama, Ecuador, Italy, Switzerland, > Ireland, France, ... . I always like math and science, but needed to learn > languages to go to (the local) school. My side delectation, besides > photography, is computational linguistics, and specifically, computer > "understanding" of natural languages using semantic nets. I have an > informal relationship with a few AI research sites in the US, mainly with > Marvin Minsky at the Media labs. > There is an application to photography to linguistics that interests me, > specifically, measuring the amount of information in a picture, but not in > the Shannon way. However, I never think about that when I take a picture. > I see that you are at a university, what is your specialty? > > Paolo > > Paolo Pignatelli > > > -----Original Message----- > From: stuart phillips [mailto:stuart.phillips@umb.edu] > Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2000 9:28 AM > To: paolop@snet.net; hasselblad@kelvin.net > Subject: Re: photographers > > > Where are you from? Your name seems obviously Italian, but are you perhaps > Argentinian? > > What about cameras used by famous people? Here're two: > > Rollei 35 (miniature) - Queen of England > Leica M3 - Yul Brynner (sp) > > stuart > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Paolo Pignatelli > To: > Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2000 6:37 AM > Subject: RE: photographers > > > > Ah, so right, English is not my mother tongue, but that last pun by Leo > > takes the crown. > > > > Paolo > > > > Paolo Pignatelli > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: BobR38@aol.com [mailto:BobR38@aol.com] > > Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2000 12:45 AM > > To: hasselblad@kelvin.net > > Subject: Re: photographers > > > > > > In a message dated 9/4/00 8:10:40 PM Central Daylight Time, > > bigleo@worldnet.att.net writes: > > > > << You keep drilling us with these puns, Paolo... > > Getting a good one out of you is like pulling teeth! > > >> > > Leo, you are right....extracting a good pun out of Paolo is quite a > > challenge. > > Possibly the language could be at the root of the problem? > > > > Bob R. > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > The Hasselblad Users Group Listserv is a public service of Absolute > > Internet, Inc., which is not responsible for its content. This mailing > list > > is in no way affiliated with Victor Hasselblad AB, it's subsidiaries, or > > affiliates. > > > > To change your subscription status, go to: > > http://mail.kelvin.net/guest/RemoteListSummary/Hasselblad > > Digest archives are stored at http://www.kelvin.net/hasselblad/hassy.htm > > Searchable archives can be found at > http://www.listquest.com/arts/index.html > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > The Hasselblad Users Group Listserv is a public service of Absolute > Internet, Inc., which is not responsible for its content. This mailing list > is in no way affiliated with Victor Hasselblad AB, it's subsidiaries, or > affiliates. > > > > To change your subscription status, go to: > http://mail.kelvin.net/guest/RemoteListSummary/Hasselblad > > Digest archives are stored at http://www.kelvin.net/hasselblad/hassy.htm > > Searchable archives can be found at > http://www.listquest.com/arts/index.html > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > The Hasselblad Users Group Listserv is a public service of Absolute > Internet, Inc., which is not responsible for its content. This mailing list > is in no way affiliated with Victor Hasselblad AB, it's subsidiaries, or > affiliates. > > To change your subscription status, go to: > http://mail.kelvin.net/guest/RemoteListSummary/Hasselblad > Digest archives are stored at http://www.kelvin.net/hasselblad/hassy.htm > Searchable archives can be found at http://www.listquest.com/arts/index.html > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > The Hasselblad Users Group Listserv is a public service of Absolute Internet, Inc., which is not responsible for its content. This mailing list is in no way affiliated with Victor Hasselblad AB, it's subsidiaries, or affiliates. > > To change your subscription status, go to: http://mail.kelvin.net/guest/RemoteListSummary/Hasselblad > Digest archives are stored at http://www.kelvin.net/hasselblad/hassy.htm > Searchable archives can be found at http://www.listquest.com/arts/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2000 03:47:15 -0300 From: "Eduardo Aigner" To: Subject: http://fly.to/partenon Message-ID: <000501c00d97$254251e0$2e46f8c8@EduardoAigner> http://fly.to/partenon AIGNER mEU mAIL mUDOU pARA: aigner.ez@terra.com.br ------------------------------ End of hasselblad V1 #980 ************************* ---------------------------------------------------------------------- The Hasselblad Users Group Listserv is a public service of Absolute Internet, Inc., which is not responsible for its content. This mailing list is in no way affiliated with Victor Hasselblad AB, it's subsidiaries, or affiliates. To change your subscription status, go to: http://mail.kelvin.net/guest/RemoteListSummary/Hasselblad Digest archives are stored at http://www.kelvin.net/hasselblad/hassy.htm Searchable archives can be found at http://www.listquest.com/arts/index.html